00:45:25Guest29624:Guest29624 is now known as jgarzik
01:08:44michagogo|cloud:01:04:12 jtimon: I have my usual story of a bug that could have killed someone caused by how C doesn't have indentation as syntax
01:10:35sipa:* sipa guesses: the apple openssl thing?
01:10:59michagogo|cloud:sipa: Apple OpenSSL thing?
01:11:05michagogo|cloud:;;google apple openssl
01:11:06gribble:Why is Apple Deprecating OpenSSL in MacOS 10.7 (Lion)? - Stack ...: ; openssl(1ssl) Mac OS X Manual Page - Apple Developer: ; Transmitting Data Securely - Apple Developer: (1 more message)
01:13:11michagogo|cloud:...holy crap
01:13:57michagogo|cloud:sipa: Thanks
01:14:08michagogo|cloud:but I don't think petertodd was referring to that
01:14:34nsh:unless he's remarkable prescient :)
01:14:42michagogo|cloud:I don't think that's a bug that could have killed someone, and it's recent
01:14:51michagogo|cloud:It wouldn't be a "usual story"
01:15:15sipa:just sounded remarkably similar: indentation as syntax, and C
01:15:22nsh:it did remind me of a "usual story" though: reflections on trusting trust
01:15:30nsh:(as the update mechanism to fix this bug is secured by... ssl)
01:17:02michagogo|cloud:nsh: *an* update mechanism
01:17:34nsh:* nsh nods
01:18:56Deuplonicus:Deuplonicus is now known as _captjet23
01:19:32nsh:(i'd guess the preponderance of devices affected will be patched over the network)
01:21:16michagogo|cloud:Definitely the majority of OS X machines will
01:21:56michagogo|cloud:Since updating a Mac w/o the builtin update mechanism means going to their website to download the update manually
01:22:38michagogo|cloud:While with iOS devices, many people who regularly plug in to their computer to sync may see and install the update through iTunes.
01:23:26michagogo|cloud:(also, I do think the update itself is signed separately from the SSL connection)
01:24:40michagogo|cloud:* michagogo|cloud updates his phone
01:25:20nsh:* nsh nods
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06:35:17petertodd:michagogo|cloud: I find it darkly amusing that the SSL bug was indentation related...
06:36:22petertodd:michagogo|cloud: but yeah, it was for firmware for a power supply monitoring system that needed to alert the operator if some conditions went out of range. this power supply being on an airplane not getting a timely alert of an impending fire could be very, very, very bad, yet for other reasons it wasn't as simple as "just make it shut down"
06:37:37petertodd:michagogo|cloud: so I wound up spending a good month writing, like 100 lines of firmware that tested some sensors and figured out what lights to flash. stupidly trivial, but by god I was going to make sure it worked perfectly under any circumstance - I didn't even have a single loop in the code and relied on the watchdog timer for that, thereby testing it's functionality constantly!
06:39:24petertodd:michagogo|cloud: of course, I handed it off to our main firmware developer later, who fucked it up in various ways, including making it possible for the warning lights to stay dark in the event of an abnormal condition - the latter bug being solidly indentation related and just like the apple one, would have been much harder to make in python
07:02:02jgarzik:petertodd, RE indentation
07:02:36jgarzik:petertodd, This Apple SSL bug is an excellent example of a possible NSA implant in open source
07:03:06jgarzik:An open source implant is certainly not impossible. You just have to work harder to hide in plain sight.
07:03:06petertodd:absolutely, just dumb enough to convince people otherwise
07:04:21phantomcircuit:jgarzik, to be fair im not aware of *anybody* who has ever reviewed that code
07:05:14phantomcircuit:what apple gets for writing thier own version of everything
07:05:59petertodd:phantomcircuit: and what's hard about it is stopping people who have been paid off to sabotage your projects is incredibly difficult from a social point of view
07:14:59phantomcircuit:gmaxwell isn't here
07:15:18phantomcircuit:but i actually expect mtgox to keep generating invalid transactions of all kinds for a while
07:15:29phantomcircuit:even after they reinstate transactions
07:15:40petertodd:because of saved tx's in their wallet?
07:16:26phantomcircuit:because the business case for fixing it (which iirc was <1% of transactions) isn't as obvious as preventing double withdrawals
07:16:37phantomcircuit:they can fix double withdrawals without fixing invalid transactions
07:16:45phantomcircuit:(and indeed it would be much faster)
07:18:59phantomcircuit:for sure if i was them it wouldn't be my top priority
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07:58:47midnightmagic::-/ what the heck, where do they get access to minted coined anyway and why are there so many of them for mtgox to spend
08:00:04phantomcircuit:midnightmagic, people set their eligius address to mtgox addresses
08:00:15phantomcircuit:iirc that accounts for 100% of them
08:00:19midnightmagic:ah. that makes sense.
08:00:35midnightmagic:That would explain why they're trying to spend them too early too
09:20:38Guest70237:Guest70237 is now known as Muis
09:31:08nsh__:nsh__ is now known as nsh
09:46:59michagogo|cloud:Is Eligius the only pool that pays miners in coinbase?
09:47:23michagogo|cloud:Actually, no it's not -- p2pool does too. Are there any others?
10:19:47HM:HM is now known as HM2
10:53:49gmaxwell:of course, the first reply is moronic.
10:54:10gmaxwell:one might wonder how they don't manage to drown when they go out in the rain.
10:55:07warren:at least Luke-Jr's reply was helpful
10:55:40nsh:* nsh blinks
10:56:23gmaxwell:back in 2011 I once patched bitcoin so that IsMine returned true. At the time this worked okay (though the resulting wallet.dat was like 2GBytes)
10:56:38gmaxwell:Didn't think to bring up the GUI and make a screenshot.
10:58:50nsh:i'm more jealous of their having a coveted @example.com email address
10:59:48warren:yeah, I expect to get blackmail threats about handing that domain over
11:06:31nsh:* nsh smiles
16:03:34orwell.freenode.net:topic is: "Bitcoin research, hardfork wishlist, ideas for the future - see also: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Hardfork_Wishlist https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/User:Gmaxwell/alt_ideas. This channel is logged at http://download.wpsoftware.net/bitcoin/wizards/. For questions about the logs talk to andytoshi."
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18:05:17azariah4:The future is here, support for running a Bitcoin node/wallet on Lego EV3: https://vine.co/v/MmvAFpU02nP
18:08:08andytoshi:10:07:06 is there a huge go-to bitcoin web development resource?
18:08:19andytoshi:we really need to write a 'stop handling others' money!' document
18:08:44tt_away:I dig the cat
18:14:17sipa:andytoshi: http://canibuildasitehandlingotherpeoplesmoney.com/
18:15:15sipa:(by michagogo|cloud)
18:17:20nsh_:nice colour-scheme
18:22:04michagogo|cloud:If anyone has any ideas on how to improve that, let me know :-P
18:22:30nsh_:it's pretty good as is :)
18:22:56michagogo|cloud:(Also, it might be a good idea to make it a more serious page at some point, actually explaining the issues.)
18:27:23nsh_:* nsh_ nods
18:34:19sipa:michagogo|cloud: ask a dozen questions about how they plan to handle money, whether they have thought about cold storage, checked with a lawyer, what language they're writing in, whether they accept 0-conf transactions, ...
18:34:27sipa:but always end up with answer no
18:35:04michagogo|cloud:sipa: Okay, if you make that, I can put it there :-P
18:35:53michagogo|cloud:* michagogo|cloud could barely get what's there now to work with a bunch of Googling and "borrowing" a code snippet from Wikipedia
18:37:17shesek:heh, I haven't seen and used for ages
18:37:21shesek:since geocities days
18:39:12michagogo|cloud:shesek: it's not even a real
18:39:20michagogo|cloud:That tag doesn't actually do anything
18:39:28michagogo|cloud:At least, not in Chrome
18:39:47michagogo|cloud:I copied a script from Wikipedia to replicate it
18:40:32michagogo|cloud:(It's , but it could just as easily have been
18:40:45michagogo|cloud:Btw, have you found out any more about that conference?
18:43:05shesek:yeah, I think browsers removed at some point
18:43:21shesek:and found out more about what?
18:44:13sipa:michagogo|cloud: i know nothing about websites
18:44:29michagogo|cloud:sipa: same
18:44:40michagogo|cloud:shesek: the thing on Thursday
18:45:52shesek:I found out that I should be speaking there, but not much other than that
18:46:29shesek:I asked if I can get people in, but didn't get an answer yet
18:46:40shesek:would you like to come if I can?
18:49:03michagogo|cloud:shesek: I don't know for sure if I would be able to make it, but if all the logistics were to work out it'd be cool to go
18:50:10shesek:cool, I'll update you
18:59:44qwertyoruiop:google blink html
19:25:34shesek:qwertyoruiop, haha, that's neat
19:25:37shesek:never heard of that
19:25:41qwertyoruiop:me neither
19:26:03qwertyoruiop:yea lol i never knew it
19:26:06qwertyoruiop:i just googled it
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21:06:49michagogo|cloud:Does it make some element of the page blink?
21:12:37shesek:michagogo|cloud, yeah, the words "blink" and "html"
21:12:48shesek:check out that link
21:13:10michagogo|cloud:Does it work on mobile?
21:14:31michagogo|cloud:It does
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