00:00:09Eliel:we did discuss the possibility of using the extra bandwidth for distributing older blocks and/or the utxo set and that's where fountain codes could help.
00:00:56gmaxwell:Eliel: I've tried to work that out before an the fact that the definition of olders blocks rolls forward makes it weird to think about.
00:01:18ryan-c:you could maybe use some sort of windowing system
00:01:25gmaxwell:e.g. what distribution do you need of your sampling to get a graph thats recoverable at all.
00:02:14gmaxwell:you've seen https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/User:Gmaxwell/block_network_coding I assume?
00:02:34ryan-c:instead of transmitting the last 10 blocks, transmit a group of 10 blocks until the last block in the group is 10 blocks old, them move to the next group
00:02:36Eliel:the bandwidth available for the moment is minimal, though, so it'd be a very slow method of downloading the blockchain :)
00:03:09Eliel:gmaxwell: seen, yes... actually read? ... umm, not entirely.
00:03:12gmaxwell:ryan-c: sure, though it doesn't give you a way to get the history.
00:03:47ryan-c:gmaxwell: right, but as Eliel said, i don't think there's enough bandwidth to get the whole history in any sane amount of time anyway.
00:04:04Eliel:I'll give the kryptoradio guy the link though.
00:04:05ryan-c:Eliel: It's something like 9600 baud, isn't it?
00:04:28Eliel:16kB/s is the speed being leased at the moment.
00:04:46ryan-c:oh, that's a lot more than i thought it was
00:04:52gmaxwell:the blockchains keep up peak rate is ~14kbps... so not a lot of room for history.
00:05:14ryan-c:bits or bytes?
00:05:29Eliel:getting more bandwidth is a matter of finding someone willing to pay for it. Not cheap.
00:05:43gmaxwell:oh actually there is a lot of room for history then.
00:06:00ryan-c:(i'm guessing gmaxwell meant bits, then)
00:06:32Eliel:... I better make sure my memory is correct. I do think it was bytes, but :)
00:08:14gmaxwell:ryan-c: in any case the best I came up with really amounted to just having subchannels repeating various windows e.g. last 4 blocks, last 8... last whatever. in loops. assuming the transport was reliable adding the erasure code didn't seem to buy a ton for the always appending case.
00:08:27gmaxwell:unless you have something like multiple sources (an adhoc network)
00:14:54Eliel:ok, apparently my memory didn't serve me too well this time. The current broadcast bandwidth for kryptoradio at the moment is 960 bytes per second.
00:15:32ryan-c:Eliel: nine hundred sixty?
00:18:20sipa:enough for 600 kilobyte blocks :)
00:19:25Eliel:more bandwidth is possible, but quite expensive.
00:30:54Luke-Jr:Eliel: less expensive than 600 kB blocks.
00:32:03Eliel:Luke-Jr: yes, not quite that expensive.
00:33:04GnarSith:im hosting bitcoin gizzard thanksgiving dinner
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15:00:58sipa:#bitcoin please :)
16:04:11tacotime:is there any real consequence of truncating hashing a secp256k1 pubkey with sha256 and truncating it to 160 bytes as opposed to hashing with RIPEMD160?
16:04:23tacotime:s/truncating hashing/hashing
16:05:12zooko:Not as far as anyone has published.
16:09:41zooko:But you mean 160 bits, I guess.
16:12:53tacotime:correct, heh
16:14:41zooko:(But I recommend BLAKE2. ;-))
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16:18:48tacotime:speaking of which, are there any papers detailing theoretical attacks on blake2b?
16:19:48tacotime:oh, just found one. https://eprint.iacr.org/2013/467.pdf
16:21:14zooko:Yeah, that's the only one: t
16:21:40zooko:Although there's an argument that hopefully any weakness in BLAKE2 would have shown up when people studied BLAKE, ChaCha, and Salsa20
16:22:09zooko:Here's my pitch for why BLAKE2 is awesome: https://blake2.net/acns/slides.html
16:23:02tacotime:i had wanted to swap it into my fork for a while to replace sha256 because the performance on cpu was so nice looking.
16:24:11tacotime:well, i think litecoin shows salsa20/8 works, and if salsa works i'm sure chacha does too.
16:24:55sipa:i don't think scrypt has particularly strong demands from its underlying stream cipher
16:25:26sipa:(as in, salsa could be pretty broken for many purposes, but still be perfect for use in scrypt)
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