00:29:48rusty:Woah, I found the perfect image for sidechains: http://www.vitacost.com/Images/Products/1000/Momma/Momma-Toddler-Soft-Fork-Orange-044677710176.jpg
00:33:20op_mul:rusty: that has got to be the least effective fork ever.
00:34:08rusty:op_mul: but who could oppose such a soft fork? It's BPA free and it clearly says it's going to be 6 months + before deployment.
00:34:46rusty:op_mul: plus, it's "extendable"! It's the soft fork to end all soft forks :)
00:35:02op_mul:I'd call it a spoof. it's more spoon than fork.
00:38:29rusty:op_mul: True, but there are enough spoof bitcoin projects in the world already...
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04:30:10rusty:gmaxwell: I'm having a brain fade. What was the term you used for returning bitcoins from a sidechain to the main chain?
05:18:03Pan0ram1x:Pan0ram1x is now known as Guest19027
07:02:00op_mul:I have a horrible feeling that stealth addresses are becoming a "standard" without any of the interesting stuff added to them. we'll probably end up with centralised, no payment ID mode ones for good :(
07:05:21gmaxwell:seems unlikely. Due to complete tonedefness they've been given an intentionally 'edgy' name that leave most wallets actively unwilling to implement them.
07:06:00gmaxwell:it's just as well, since the tech needs to be stronger to not have them be a net-negative for user privacy all things considered.
07:11:51op_mul:that comment came from a reddit post talking about a new service "supporting" them.
07:17:26op_mul:turns out it was just another scary "manually manage your private keys in a browser with javascript" thing.
08:24:48Luke-Jr:op_mul: I like the "email transaction" version better anyway. no id needed, no OP_RETURN needed. :p
08:26:11Luke-Jr:(that is, wrap a transaction+data in a payment protocol structure and send it via email; recipient has duty to announce to the network after telling his wallet about the key)
08:28:32op_mul:Luke-Jr: somehow I don't think people will latch onto that. give it a swankier name and pitch it again.
08:29:37Luke-Jr:op_mul: "send to person" :P
08:29:53Luke-Jr:"address-free bitcoin"
08:30:01op_mul:ship it.
08:31:49Luke-Jr:"real bitcoin™"
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08:49:11op_mul:Luke-Jr: I don't like that actually. at least with HTTP it's sort of easy to tell if the page you are visiting is "secure". with email it's anybodies guess.
08:49:36Luke-Jr:op_mul: doesn't matter much unless you use the wrong base key with the email
08:49:50Luke-Jr:it's still just a signed transaction that needs a private key to redeem ;)
08:51:01op_mul:oh yep. I follow. I thought you meant moving BIP70 into an email form, but you meant just sending the ephemeral portion of the "stealth" address directly to the person rather than have them scan for it.
08:53:07op_mul:not super slick though.
08:54:02op_mul:if you lose the ephemeral key you either have to use a non-SPV client and scan every transaction, or outsource it. I know what most people will do.
08:55:04Luke-Jr:op_mul: or ask the sender to resend
08:55:12Luke-Jr:not sure why you'd lose it though
08:56:09Luke-Jr:but then, my email is stored in git <.<
08:56:12op_mul:I was thinking if you lost/destroyed/whatever your wallet and recovered it with a BIP32 seed.
08:57:42Luke-Jr:oh, hm
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09:20:32op_mul:Luke-Jr: I suppose that's a niche issue.
09:23:01Luke-Jr:op_mul: not sure. half the benefit of HD wallets is a single backup
09:23:45Luke-Jr:I suppose the transaction could always have the OP_RETURN in it still, and only use the email so you get metadata with it
12:00:47rusty:rusty has left #bitcoin-wizards
19:20:21tacotime:w/r/t stealth addresses, i'll see if i can implement it out of band this month in btcd/btcwallet
19:21:18tacotime:i think that's a good way to do it for now; just export the data that's normally OP_RETURN'd with in JSON for the user to ship off to the receiver from some OOB mechanism
19:22:49tacotime:then users can make QR codes to put on their business cards or whatever, with [OOB_contact_info]&[stealth_address] embedded into it
19:23:14tacotime:then it's just a matter of forwarding the data and txhash
19:23:42tacotime:--> actually usable non-reusable addresses :P
19:28:11tacotime:i maybe derive the scan privkey from the spend privkey by hashing too, since we do that for monero and it seems relatively safe so far.
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